Why not like Poles. Russian and Poles.

Relationship between two peoples, especially if they have some kind of common story - the topic is always slippery and not deprived of a certain number of stereotypes. This statement is fully related to the relationship between Poles and Russians. We put the question even more categorically: why the Poles hate Russians?

Of course, you can argue with this statement, leading examples of cooperation between representatives of two Slavic peoples, mutual assistance and support. However, events recent years They convince that some tension between Poland and Russia still exists and over time does not weaken, and sometimes it is seriously enhanced.

Let's stop their gaze on the relationship between the two peoples and try to allocate specific reasons for the reasons of the Russian world among the Poles.

Geography

Neighboring countries almost never have good relationships - this thesis can be confirmed by examples of a number of European states, which at best restrained each other.

The British do not tolerate the French, the French do not like the Spaniards. Offensive nicknames, riding traditions and external view - All this is in relations between the peoples who historically live nearby.

There is a particularly strong rejection in the event that countries are also direct competitors for anything, whether marine dominion, trade or protectorate over the whole Eastern EuropeAs it was in the case of the Russian Empire and the Commonwealth speech, which included the Polish kingdom and the Lithuanian principality.

Religion

An important element of the life of any people is a religion, which is a kind of marker, which makes it clear to the line "His one's own". Let's see how things are with this part public Life In Poland and in Russia.

Some statistics:

• According to polls, more than 86 percent of Poles belong to the Roman Catholic denomination.
• In Russia, about 75 percent of the population refers to Orthodoxy.

From the point of view of religion, Russians for Poles are nonsense; Not yet heretics, but already rejected from the true Christian teaching. In Catholic Europe, the Orthodox long time was not considered to be Christians: so, oriental barbarians who connected the pagan beliefs with the teachings of Christ.

By the way, the image of the eastern barbarians who prefer to live under despotic authorities actively cultivated and moved the Polish to be known in the West, which represented its country with some buffer between enlightened Europe and Wild Asia. This cliché is perfectly preserved in the folk consciousness, and the following generations western Slavs. I absorbed it from birth.

History

After studying the geographical and religious aspects of the relations between Russian and Poles, one can move to historical reasons for dislike of two Slavic peoples.

Above the relationship between the Russian Empire and the Commonwealth speech was already the relationship - the two largest countries of Eurasia. Naturally, such a neighborhood did not suit the Russian rulers, so they tried in every way to influence the affairs of the Polish state, without giving him to gain strength.

Of course not only influence Russian Empire It was the cause of the collapse of the Polish-Lithuanian Empire. But the fact is a fact: in the period from 1772 to 1795. There were three sections of the Commonwealth, as a result of which the Polish and Lithuanian territories moved away to the Prussian kingdom, the Russian Empire and the Austrian monarchy.

Relationships in the XX century

If the events of the century XVIII could still be forgotten and smoothed over time, the history of the 20th century was going on quite recently and was also "rich" to Russian-Polish conflicts.

It all started with the Soviet-Polish war (Polish-Bolshevik War in the official Polish historiography) 1919-1921. Young soviet state in terrible conditions civil War I tried to turn the borders of the new state. The leadership of Poland led by Yuzef Pilsudsky took an attempt to restore historic borders Commonwealth, wanting to return to Belarus, Ukraine, Lithuania and still a number of areas at his disposal.

As a result of this armed conflict, none of the parties reached its goals. Poland could not completely return the land lost in the XVIII century, but did not "red", as the Soviet leadership wanted. A peace treaty was signed between the countries, but the relationship between the peoples became even more intense.

It is worth adding the section of Poland between Germany and the Soviet Union in 1939. According to official Polish historiography, the actions of the Red Army must be interpreted as aggression against Poland.

One of the most painful points in russian-Polish relations is the Katynsky shot. The number 4421 (the number of killed in the Katyn forest) knows each Pole. Despite the fact that official russian persons In 2010 recognized this terrible tragedy of the crime stalinist regime, the overwhelming number of Russians, according to polls, consider talking about Katynsky execution irrelevant. This position is seriously touched by the feelings of the Poles and strengthens their rejection of the Russian world.

All the events described left a deep mark in the genetic memory of Poles. It has long been not for a long time on this light of the perpetrators of many tragedies, the Soviet Union disappeared from a political card, and Russia chose another path of development, but the dislike between the peoples is preserved and poured into new collisions.

After the expulsion of the Jews in 1492, from Spain to 80% of the European Jewry moved to Poland and skillfully straightened the Slavs to Slavs.

The army of Bogdan Khmelnitsky was not good reduced by the number of Jews.

After joining almost half of Poland to Russia, a significant part of Jewry was already in the Russian Empire, committed a Jewish coup in 1917, taking leadership posts and arranged the Genocide of Slavs.

The original is taken by W. dakarmos. In why Poles hate Russians and vice versa

I believe that among countries, Lyuto hated by Russia, number one in Poland list. I do not know why historically it happened, but there is something that is. This country on any world discussion platforms is trying to hurt Russia. They are constantly for any "kipish", if only Russia would crap and pierce. So let's figure it out and try to understand why the Poles are so hated by Russians. By the way, Russians belong to the Poles are clearly more condescendingly, but also without much enthusiasm.
Over the centuries, Russia and Poland were unfriendly neighbors, we often fought, and very often blew themselves with these Poles, and the proud Polish Nodec copied anger for years. True there was one period of history when "Panya" managed to climb over Russia. Remember the troubled time? When the Poles in the Moscow Kremlin hosted and dreamed of Russia to divide and plunder. But again it did not succeed, again they got squeaks and run away.

Russians for some time at all over Poland verified, Poland was as one of the provinces of the Russian Empire. We divided them geographically several times, in short, that they wanted them and did with these frowns. And they did well deservedly and on the rights of the winner. All strictly under the law of war.
Although our peoples are very relative, all the same, we are all Slavs, in fact, Russia and Poland and now the worst enemies. They accuse Russia in the occupation, in the genocide, in the death of their president, the impression that only Russia is always to blame in all the troubles of Poland.
Through Western Ukraine, which was always close to Poland, one time it was generally the territory of the "Commonwealth", it seems so called Poland, they are trying and now put sticks in the wheels of Russia. Even when football matches are held between Russia and Poland, the Poles are always trying to come on our fans.
In the UN, EU, NATO, just everywhere Poland more than all yell and runs on Russia. So what is the reason?
I think that once the Poles were imperial spruce, but they did not come out, now they are a small, not a sovereign state looking into the US mouth and NATO, and so wanted to be big and strong. And Russia, though she suffered a number of geopolitical lesions, although we are now far from the best of times, it's still a big and strong country, with frantic potential. Here are their toad and stupid, this little, rotten, Pansky Narodishko ...

________________________________________ ____________________________________

all the same, it is sometimes useful to teach the story to not show your ignorance in such a rough form! Poles and Russians, when then one people, our roots are common, just as the Germans mostly left the Slavs, but this is a separate song! As for the Poles, most of the Poles are normally relate to the Russians, especially the older generation, from the young youth educational normally, well, by the cattle, it is Veda cattle! The project of Poland itself, was created in opposition to Russian, handling consciousness and incitement of hatred, this is an ancient reception of managing nations (now we have happiness to observe the most politics in Ukraine), and now most of Polish publications and the media publish frankly Russophobic articles, understanding that Poland is not an independent country, the career can make people broadcasting certain political Views etc., generally built a whole system for the development and maintenance of a certain level of Russophobism in society! Do not see it and reduce all to your hate to the Poles, this is the best that they can come up with dumbers facing in essence one people in a fratricide war! You still need to learn to think and know the story, there are many answers today!

The American company Pew Research Center published the results of its recent studies in which she studied the attitude towards Russia in different countries. The surveys participated 45,000 people from 40 states, including Poland. 80% of our compatriots said about their negative attitude, only 15% continue to relate to our Eastern neighbor with sympathy.

The number of Russophobes among the Poles increases as a geopolitical situation becomes increasingly tense. According to the Center for Public Opinion Research (CBOS), in 1993 they had 56%, a year ago - about the same amount, 54%, and now they have become 30% more. Why did it happen?

An attack on Ukraine, the seizure of the Crimea, as well as the fear of the attack by Russia: these are the main reasons for change in public sentiments. "Relationships with Moscow have become a challenge to Poland," Professor Edward Halizak, an international relations specialist from Warsaw University, emphasizes in conversation with Wirtualna Polska (Edward Haliżak). "Polish hostility to Russia has two reasons. The first is the events of history, all those defeats who have applied for many centuries Russia. The fact that we were under her dominion and for many years fought with economic lag. Poles are well remembered, and the conviction in the fault of Russians over time is only strengthened, "says Professor Henric Domansky (Henryk Domański) from the Polish Academy of Sciences. "Besides, the Poles continue to believe that our neighbor is on another, lower cultural level."

"Now in Poland, antiputin moods prevail. This is largely transferred to a negative attitude towards the state and, to a lesser extent, to the Russian population. This approach stems from the fact that Russian society mainly maintains the actions of President Putin, especially in the context of rivalry with the West. If Russians treated him critical or at least neutrally, then the mood of the Poles would be different, "the institute employee believes international relations Warsaw University Maci Pardon (Maciej Raś).

"Relations with Russia should be left at the level of free drift. Poland from Russia can not get anything, there is nothing for us, "the Edward Halizak summarizes us.

Not only Poles

The question of the attitude to Putin's Putin was asked not only to the Poles, but also, in particular, Australians, Americans, Germans, Ukrainians and Japanese. Do not have respect for Russia, respectively, 62, 67, 70, 72 and 73% of them. Why? "In addition to several minerals, Russia has nothing to offer," says Professor Khalizhak.

In addition to Poles, only Jordanians are equal to Russia in addition to the Poles: 80% of them are talking about a negative attitude towards the Eastern Power, although in sympathy to it a little more respondents are recognized than in Poland - 18%. American experts from Pew Research Center believe that low level Sympathies in Russia in this country is associated with Russian support for the regime of Bashar Assad: it caused a massive influx in the Jordan of immigrants.

Although half of the world and almost all of Europe does not like Russia, 30% of respondents do not see anything wrong with that politics that Putin's Power holds. Most of all supporters of Russia were discovered in Vietnam (75%), Ghana (56%) and China (51%).

Not only Russia

The world does not like not only Russia, but also Vladimir Putin itself. And it is even stronger. The Russian president criticizes three quarters of states, mainly from the European and North American continent. Here, the first place is occupied by the Spaniards: 92% of them consider Putin's policies incorrect. 87% of Poles also stated about a negative attitude to the President of Russia. Putin cannot count on the support of the French (it criticizes 85% of respondents) and Ukrainians (84%).

Why do Poles do not like Putin? "For several reasons. First of all, because Putin translated Russia for a course, which is very different from the Western development model in both the internal aspect and in the field international Policy. Speech about the ubiquitous corruption in Russia, other economic model. In addition, Putin clearly makes it clear that Russia will incarnate his interests even in confrontation of the West, including Poland, "says Maci Rass. - In the past, the Poles also had a negative effect on the leaders of Russia and the USSR. So it was with the kings, with the Secretary-General of the Party, so left at Putin. "

About 70% of Vietnamese, as well as the majority of residents included in the survey of African states, speak of their sympathies to the Russian president. However, US experts emphasize that such an opinion is mainly due to the lack of clear opinions and information on the policy of the Russian president's policy, and not with real support.

Such votes remain nonetheless in the minority. As stresses in a conversation with Wirtualna Polska Maci, people often see a threat to the entire Western civilization. "Putin is considered not only a non-democratic leader, despot, tyrant, aggressor in Ukraine, but also a source of conflict, threat to Western world. Someone who absorbed dislikes to the West with Mother's Milk, and made the essence of Russian actions in the international arena from this hostility, "the expert indicates.

Eh!
Here I can't understand a fig, for which the Poles do not like me like that. But I have never met any ethnic Pole to this afternoon. I could not go to him the road, could not step on his leg, could not seduce his girl, could not after a glass of Russian vodka or a glass of Polish vodka, they also drink vodka, fill the face with one of the Poles. I have never been in foreign EuropeSo I even could not throw the cigarette on Polish land.
Do not love because I am Russian?
And why do the Poles do not like Russians?
I adore chopin. I can endlessly listen to my "farewell from the homeland" of Oginsky, and from listening to this masterpiece, I have a gray mouse on my goosebumps, yes that there are mice, roses run. I have read the prus, Mitskevich, Senkevich. I adored Stanislav Lem. His Star diaries of Jione quietly "re-read the hundred times, I'm not talking about more serious things like" Magellanovo Cloud "," Invasion with Aldebaran "," Solaris ".
So why the Poles do not like Russians in general, and in particular me?
For giving Pink Lhadmitry in the Kremlin? Well, do not blame me, this is our behavior. For the fact that Ivan Susanin is not the ones of our sights to show Polish conquerors? So let them not like Susanin, and here the rest? For the fact that Ukraine at one time moved from Poland to Russia, and then most of Poland became part of the Russian Empire? So after all, the relationship of the compulsion quite a few nations at one time picked up. A large piece of Poland was part of Austria-Hungary. Poles also can not tolerate Hungarians and Austrians? Won and Finland also had a province of Russia, and such a hatred of Russians from Finns seems to be like. For the fact that in the twenties, weekly and Tukhachevsky decided Lviv and Warsaw Cavalrysky to capture. So there they are on the ears and got. For the fact that in 1939 the USSR joined Western Ukraine and Western Belarus to his territory? Let me, but Poland only gained those borders that were identified by the Brest Treaty. And the Poles themselves at the same time, having agreed with Germany, a piece of the Czech Republic trembled for themselves. And those lands that were attached to the USSR, today the Russians do not belong. And blood soviet soldierIncluding Russian Poles soldiers received most of the Eastern Prussia previously belonging to Germany after World War II. Here, of course, you can remember the Polish People's Republic under the aegis of" Soviet Union From 1944 to 1989. Brothers, so Poles have already got rid of the "oppression" of the Russians and their "harslers" 28 years ago, Poland as part of the United Europe, and where is the breakthrough? The economy is growing like on yeast?
Oh, damn, tired, tired of writing, and tired of all this dirty underwear. Many people do not like the Russians, and many Russians do not like, but it is not because we are all the bad bad. Just because ...
Vladimir does not like many, and there are many reasons for that. And Alexandra does not love only his wife, and that, only when he gets drunk from work. Why? Just Alexander Plumbing of the House Government, and Vladimir President of the Great State.

Oh, that's long story. Very mysterious. There are so many factors ...

Immediately make a reservation, the Ukrainians of the Poles do not like even more, but for another reason. I know many wonderful Poles, which are well referred to both Russians and Ukrainians. But the overall hostility is present.

Poles love their history very much, and in this story there were many different moments.

If you remember, they did not want to recognize Ivan the Terrible king, and they continued to call the Grand Duke Moscow, which gave rise to conflicts. And these trips to Moscow ... They were sitting in the Kremlin, like at home. Poles and today believe that the Russian treacherously violated the obligation in which the right of the Polish king to the Russian kingdom was recognized.

They stood so cool so, and then suddenly everything was gone. The rising of Khmelnitsky, as a result of which they lost all the left bank of the Dnieper. Further more. All these sections of Poland, turning it to the Russian province. Suppression by Russian troops of repeated uprisings (by the way, one of them is suppressed by Suvorov). And so on and so forth. They walked with Napoleon - hoping to return the lost. Already at the beginning of the twentieth century, the dictator Pilsudsky gave a new hope. He promised to revive talking to the sea to the sea. And in 1920 began to implement the promise. When in response the Cossacks of Budennye went to Lviv, and Tukhachevsky on Warsaw, Polyakov it was so offended ...

And 39th year? Russian invaders! For some reason, it did not occur to anyone that Poland was just returned to the borders of 1918, recorded by the Brest Treaty. For some reason, no one remembered that before this Poland had exactly the same agreement with Germany and pulled apart by agreement with the Germans of a piece of the Czech Republic.

Finally, 1945. Russians here like here. Again invaders!

We will not analyze the validity of their position, just this is the causes of hostility. Russian bad, they are barbarians, they are aggressive, rude and cruel. They oppressed and destroyed the Polish people! And Ukrainians, among other things, also cattle, which previously served them.

What to love them, these Russians?

But if you ask some Polish professor Janosha's chamber: why don't you love Russian? He will answer very beautiful and with arguments

Polish-Russian War

Conversation with Professor Januschi Tazbir

- Why don't we love Russian?

You need to start with the fact that the closest neighbors do not like at all. The French do not tolerate the British, and the Spaniards are French, etc. I read the "sketch of a nurse" [Angeya Bobkovsky] - Notes of the time of World War II, - and there seems to be as ambiguous and controversial was the attitude of the French to [Hitler's] raids on the UK, and some even wondered who they are more enemy - Germans or the British . Once I asked Chekhov, what kind of people they love. I was answered by the half-hearth, half amenis, that New Zealandsev, because they are very far away. Secondly, if one state takes away from the other part of the territory and tries to destroy the indigenous population and deprive of his national appearance, it is difficult to expect the Poles to love the Russians. In turn, the Russians did not like Polyakov, in particular, due to the fact that those are assumed and watching others. Take, for example, memories in the "Notes from the Dead Home" of Fyodor Dostoevsky. There are reference gentles are proud of their torment and go on their nose, because they suffer for their homeland, in other words, for the right thing.

Mary Dombrovskaya has a very interesting statement in the "nights and days" - the heroine reads Gogol, Turgenev, Lion Tolstoy, and their works like her very much, but then she says: "What are you inhibiting us, how do you like us?" - implies "wonderful".

It seems to me that now there is a distinct fracture, and in Poland the Russian stereotype changes. At the 10th anniversary stadium, you can buy Soviet orders or dads with a star. It can be seen how the empire sells all sorts of remnants, and this means a large-scale discharge of those complexes that have accumulated for long years. One Russian, who lives in emigration in Paris, told me: "I hate Bolshevism, but I experienced so much humiliations from the French that, seeing their fear of soviet army, I am glad, - for me it is some satisfaction. "

Russians in the XVIII century deprived us of territories and sovereignty, but what was our idea of \u200b\u200bRussian person and attitude to Russia to the parties of Poland?

So much was mentioned about our entry into Europe. This is bullshit. We never come out of any of Europe. Europe as a single military community never existed. Yes, and as an economic community is also not. But it existed as a community cultural and moral, and we belonged to it, because, for example, studied in the same universities as the French, Italians or Germans. But Russia, as well as Turkey, who now wants to enter the European Union, did not relate to this community. Russians were considered barbarians. It even denied that Orthodox is Christians. Consequently, they looked at the Russians very much "top down" and treated them with an extraordinary disregard.

- What saw us at that time the Russians?

The Russians believed that, perhaps, freedom in the Commonwealth and is there, but, as they talked to the Poles: "We only have a king who and the throat of our, and the property managed, and you have a boyar, then tyrant." The XVII century is a period of contempt for Poland in Russia, and on the other hand admiration for our achievements. Polish interventions, invaders, adventurers - all of them were people who knew the Western culture, bringing Latin books to Moscow, and it was they who helped to tie the first to any strong cultural contacts of Russia with the West. But this does not mean that the stay of the Poles in the Kremlin belongs to the number of glorious pages of our Polish history.

Alexander Trunkner very curiously noticed at one time that each time the establishment of cultural contacts with the West meant the end of Polish cultural influence every time. With Peter I, the Russians directly in contact with France or England, and in Gorbachev, they had the need for a window to the world, which was quite widely open in Poland, because they themselves opened the doors.

In Russia, it is difficult to believe it, but in the XVI century. There were only 17 names of books - and they were all church. During this period, six thousand books were published in Poland. Russians translated our writings, and they spread among the local elite. For russian courtyard In the second half of the XVII century. Polish played the same role as french - In the same period under the Polish yard. In Russian historiography - no longer Soviet - the thesis is now adopted that all Russian baroque was a late revival, an explosion and built on Polish roots.

- But after all, the Soviet Union was proud of a gigantic number of books published.

In the Soviet Union, some books were printed with a circulation of 50-100 copies and distributed among the members of the Politburo. With your own eyes, I saw such a publication of my beloved book, a kind of pamphlet for the French revolution, "the gods crave" Anatoly France. The revolution is represented there in such a light that it looks like a mixture, and it generates too many associations with terror and regular triumphs to publish this book with great circulation. Only after the death of Stalin, this book began to publish more grazing.

The wheel of history rotates interesting. When in the XVII century. king Sigismund III I wanted to get rid of the anarchiving gentry after the Bunt of Mikolaya Zebzhadovsky, then the court propaganda pushed the last participation in the conquest of Russia. At the same time it was said: "Muscovites are more numerous, but these are barbarians, and you will handle them as well as Spanish conquetadors coopulated with the crowd of Indians." Becoming end of XVIII. c., Sections of Poland, and at that time we have about Russians that these are the conquestors that we have won and belong to the Poles, as if by the Indians.

At one time, in the 1920s, the head of the Soviet diplomatic mission in Warsaw was appointed one of the killers of Nicholas II and his family [P.L.Vakov]. Polish Foreign Ministry protested against it. Then Chicherin - By the way, the Aristocrat who performed the role of the Minister of Foreign Affairs from the Bolsheviks, "said:" After all, you still wanted to kill the kings throughout the 19th century. So what is the matter now? "

- Who first began not to love the second - we are Russians or are they us?

At the same time. The subject of the dispute and collision between us was Lithuania. Rus was weak, and Lithuania captured those Russian lands, which was previously owned. The rivalry continued, and on this background, it was necessary to walk to conflict.

In Russia, we dealt with (and maybe, before that, we have) with the sacrament of power, whereas in the West I developed a system of controlling power. Perhaps it's not so strange that the Poles who had the Golden Shankhetsky liberty did not have special sympathy for the people who endured the yoke of despotism?

Russians believed that Golden Validity was anarchy. The principal difference was that our political opposition has always been considered a civil virtue, and they have a crime. A person who opposes the power must certainly be a madman. Tsar Nicholas I ordered to declare Chaadaeva crazy. The writer was given under the supervision of his personal hell who visited him once a month. It happened over a hundred years before the Soviet Union began to push dissidents in "Psychoshushki". In my opinion, not without reason in the USSR did not suit the special noise around the Watergate Scam. What kind of Russians means phrase: "... Installed illegal listening equipment at the opposition headquarters"? After all, the same opposition is illegal, and all allowed to be allowed!

Is it all the time formed in Russia alone, and in Poland another mentality of power and subjects? Perhaps this is precisely this difference and forms the foundation of mutual dislike?

I will give a different example. We in Poland everywhere despised the profession of the executioner. He was supposed to live in the city walls, choose his wife from among those sentenced, etc. But if in Russia (right up to the times of Catherine II) there was a public execution, then the executioner could have to choose an assistant from the crowd at any moment, and he could not give up. Such a disgusting part is documented. One day someone wanted to refuse, and Ivan Grozny noticed it. Then he commanded that a person who did not want to participate in execution cut off from sentenced genitals and ate them himself.

Not only the Poles with horror looked at Russia and Russians. Marquis Astolf de Custine in his book "Russia in 1839", which divided into Europe in hundreds of thousands of copies and was translated into many languages, wrote about despotism, all-pervading fear, marason, atrophy of creative approaches and expressed sympathy about the fate of Poles. He simply sympathized to us that he did not want to return to France through the kingdom of Polish, in order not to face our disadvantages, which were still with us, in his opinion, to have.

Yes, but Custine was an exception. Adam Mitskevich wrote about so compliant and chance of the French government to Russia, which, in his opinion, the case can reach the fact that the Cossacks will again be the Bivak on the Champs Elysees. Already in the XVIII century. Attached encyclopedists gloves the Board of Catherine II. When Voltaire reproached that he was so flattering about the despotism of the kings, he answered: "Yes, but I am such a Merzlyak, and she sent me a magnificent fur coat." Philosophers XVIII century. They were so fascinated by Russia, because the queen misled them, representing the man of the Epoch of Enlightenment. And they believed that there was a perfect case when the mighty ruler in the barbaric country is able to conduct their ideas to life. It should also be noted that the French were not interested in Polish problems. When on the outcome of the XIX century. The solemn rebelief of Mitskevich was happening at Vavele [in Krakow, then belonging to Austria-Hungary], the newspaper "Figaro" wrote that the king softened his policy towards Poland, resolving the remains of the Great Anti-Russian writer on Wawel ... under Warsaw. And when after the end of the I World War I was in Poland, the first French ambassador was driving, he was convinced that the majority of the population speaks Russian.

Did there be a dislike of Russians to Poland an integral element of their ill-advisory attitude to the West in general? In addition, Orthodox also seen in the Catholics perpetrators of the split of universal Christianity.

This is due to my favorite the theory of conspiracies, in which I do not believe, but which I study. So, we are pleased to consider ourselves so mighty that a conspiracy is treated against us. According to Orthodox propaganda, the main goal of Rome has always consisted of destroying Orthodoxy. Meanwhile, in the speech of the compulculated XVII century, Cyrillic was printed more books than in Russia. And when, on the border, these books were withimed, they were burned. At the same time, it was argued that although they distribute the Orthodox faith, but in fact they are infected with Latin Heres. The second factor of dislike was that the Russians knew perfectly well: we are spoiled by a reputation in the West. And the third reason: people do not like those who were offended and who caused harm, and offended, besides, and prevent any complaints.

Few people know, but just we began to spoil the opinion of the Russians in the West. Stefan Batori was the first of the Polish kings, which came to mind that when he was going to war, he needs not only hussars, infantry, powerful siege cars, but also field printing house. There he printed all sorts of papers, not only Latin, where he portrayed his victory in the East as a triumph over the hordes of monstrous barbarians.

- What did this barbarian look like in such propaganda publications?

Cruel, ruthless, low-disgraced. The gentry, as we said, could not feed respect for those who so easily allowing the tyranny power to subordinate themselves. It seems that those Tatars who have Senkevich say that you need to hang them quickly, and then the Kmitts is angry.

Perhaps, just a certain pylsudsky made from youth dislike to the Russians and led to the fact that he did not help "White" and did not save Russia and the whole world from Bolshevism?

To this day, the question remains unresolved about whether Pilsudsky was predicted by the victory of the Bolsheviks, refusing to help White General. I do not know whether these generals were so honest or simply so stupid. The Bolsheviks promised everything in the world and did not intend to keep any of their promises. When Pilsudsky asked the White Generals, which will be after he helps them, they answered that after the victory, the Constituent Assembly will decide, and they can not promise anything. Finns were also ready to strike in Petrograd in 1918, but they also did not want to give them specific promises either.

- Do you think that if they promised, Pilsudsky would help them?

I would help. He knew one thing: if it becomes possible to attack Red Russia, he can count on any help of the West, but if the striker will be white Russia, it is not. We were given to the Soviet Union in 1945. We ended up almost the first state in history that fought on the side of the winners, but after the victory it took out the territorial losses and losing sovereignty. Especially we would give us Russia then, in 1920.

I look closely to the fact that, maybe unites us with Russia, - to the particular situation in which the Poles, and Russians begin to believe that God intended them a unique mission.

Russia considered himself the third Rome. We have so far nobody went. Russians, like us, have seen ourselves as the fat and stronghold of the Christian world. In 1980, in the 600th anniversary of the Kulikov Battle, the poet Evtushenko wrote that if the Russians were not smashed by the Tatars, then there would be no Eiffel Tower and the Renaissance culture and that they saved the culture of Europe. The same argument appeared that we had in Poland in the XIX century: "We could not develop culture to the same extent as in the West, because they should have been protected." In this regard, the Russians believed that when they defend the culture, Orthodoxy, and we struggle with them, thereby breaking Slavic solidarity and drive them the "knife in the back."

We also saw Judas of the Slavish business, a springboard for treacherous traitors-Jesuits, for those who, instead of creatively developing the Slavic primary element, go superficial, lightweight and in monkey copies the West, although the sake of their own good should be held together with Russia. Fortunately, were also - what we know from Mitskevich - and "Russian friends", for example, the Decembrists.

Noble Bestuzhev, the same, from the poetic message of Mitskevich "to Russian friends", in real reality, was torn in 1831 to fight the Poles, which, in his opinion, will never be sincere friends of Russians. "Blood them will fool, but forever? Give God, "he wrote. And he regretted that he was sitting in Siberia, because it would be willing to fight "Panamiobi". The Decembrists performed for the "Russian Russia" and in their own way democratic, but they treated the Poles hardly friendly.

We also have another writer-prophet - Zygmunt Krasinsky and his poem "To Moskalum". Here is a quote from there: "If I could strangle you all in one argument / and imagine everyone in the same abyss, / th, after your overthrowing in hell I would like to be ..." [Translation substituent] Lyrical hero Does not distinguish oppressive and oppressors, but only hates all Russians.

We do not like Russians, because they won us in political, and in a military sense, and we tried to somehow compensate for this complex of the loser and the broken side. In addition, the Russians did not have what they could do especially to impleate us. Meroshevsky, one of the pillars of the Parisian "culture", expressed a Metaging remark about how we were lucky that in 1917 they did not defeat the cadets, because if they had introduced democracy and welfare, the Poles would be very compliant to Russification.

- And yet defined Russification occurred.

Yes, but she slowed down the memory of armed conflicts, and most of all, in my opinion, repressions. We add to this our sense of cultural and moral superiority over Russians.

However, in Moscow we are in the early years of the XVII century. learned terrible things. "Not Tokmo Boyar, men and maiden sequins, but even babies from the mother breast there was no sleep." This is a fragment of the Polish report.

Yes, constantly appeal to the past. 1612 is one of the few most important dates in Russian consciousness - along with 1812, 1917 and Patriotic War 1941-1945 The Polish occupation of the Kremlin and the cruelty accumulated then served and often continue to serve as an excuse of those acts of violence, which Russians have worked on the Poles for three centuries. Even the massacre of Prague [Right Bank of Warsaw, 1794] was considered fair retribution. Alexander Pushkin wrote: "And you, it happened, daring / Kremlin shame and royal captivity, / and we are about the stones of fallen walls / babies Prague beat." As today, when we start talking about Katyn, the Russians remember the allegedly 60-90 thousand prisoners of war who died in Polish captivity in the 1920s.

When we talking about incomplete Poland, we can talk about cooperation, and when - about collaborationism? And in general - does this word mean here?

Do not look at those times only through the prism of those who died and suffered. It has been established that thousands of those who made a state and career have come on Halmillion. These were parallel trends. In the root of Russia, to go Aaer on the steps of the social hierarchy, it was not required to move in Orthodoxy, as in the kingdom of Polish.

And in the kingdom territory knew about these Polish careers and states? What was the attitude towards them? Are such Poles with Ostracism faced?

They knew about them, but they tried to grind what was happening or morally to doubt it. Polyakov urged that those who made a career and the state in Russia are apostates, renegades, figures, suspicious in morally. Standal said that the novel is a mirror that is carried by large road Life. I argue that our literature only went on the paths of national martyrology. In Poland, the peeks did not demonstrate from didactic considerations. Ostracism, perhaps, can not be speech, because these rich Poles did not spend their states on the girls of easy behavior and luxury items, and very often helped with scientific institutions in the kingdom of Polish. For example, Warsaw scientific society Lived on revenues from crude oil mined in the Caucasus. Who knows, perhaps, part of this kind of rich wanted to dispel the remorse, caused by such luck in the Russian service. It must be said that, earning such, often fantastic states, no one has lost the opportunity to be a Polish patriot.

- What are you studying in Russia on history textbooks?

Part of historians occupies a position not even Soviet, and the royal. Undoubtedly, youth learns to praise the kings and glorify their victory. What really acts on the masses is, for example, such films as the "Siberian Barber" Nikita Mikhalkov, with its unconditional nationalist orientation.

When you read modern news from Russia, you see the coming nationalism - by the way, they also interpret the events in Poland in the same way. How, in your opinion, the Russians cope with the awareness of the collapse of their empire?

They are terribly worried. They explained so many years that if you had to stand in queues, then the whole world is afraid of them, as they have atomic bombthey fly into space and fight for best world. Before the emergence of the Soviet Union, there was no such empire in history, where the population of the metropolis would be worse than in the colonies. But this particular situation existed in Czechoslovakia, even in Poland. Many people told me in Moscow: "We had a bad thing, because we had to keep you, for you did not organize collective farms ..."

It seems to me that in Russia until today, confidence is kept in our ungratefulness. And if earlier we, Poles, Bunuya, "changed the Slavic case", now and now we do something in the same way, in their opinion, similar when we enter the European Union and, more worse, in NATO. Do you agree that we can talk about certain continuity, the continuity of the Russian perception of Poland?

Yes, and in addition to this, Russians believe that they somehow found the right to the land, which was released.

And how do the calculations of Russian citizens with their own Soviet past flow? When Anne Epplbaum printed the Book "Gulag: History", it turned out that no publishing house in Russia is interested in its publication.

After the period of restructuring and publicity, when a lot has written about communist crimes, it may have come, perhaps some fatigue. Although it is necessary to remember that in the camps were mainly Russian. Therefore, they - quite reasonably - feel victims and so far they do not want to return to this topic. This is somehow clear. According to Solzhenitsyn, the Bolshevik revolution was such a lead that the Russians could not arrange anything like their tribesmen. That is why, from his point of view, "Inomes" played a leadership role in it: Jews, Latvians, Poles, or even the Chinese. There is such an anecdote about Dzerzhinsky, which is explained in front of the compatriot: "What do you blame me? Who killed more Moskale? Our rebels in the XIX century or me? "

Led the conversation Tomas Dyatovitsky